I don't get it ...

[fembuck]

The controversy over Jennifer Lawrence being cast as Katniss in Hunger Games is confusing the hell out of me.  Basically, people are saying that casting blonde, blue-eyed Lawrence as Katniss Everdeen is Hollywood white-washing at work, but I don't get it.

In the novel Katniss is described as having dark hair, grey-eyes and olive skin, while her mother and sister are described as grey-eyed, blonde's.  The family sounds fairly caucasian to me.  From the vague descriptions in the book it's impossible to tell what exact ethnicity Katniss is, but I think it's safe to say that she's not black, brown, asian or aboriginal, so the rage and indignance that is going on right now about the character being "white-washed" is so confusing to me.

The other actresses that are generally accepted to have been in the running for Katniss were:  Hailee Steinfeld (seems to be the fan favorite), Saoirse Ronan, Chloe Moretz, Lyndsy Fonseca, Emily Browning and Kaya Scodelario.

So... 

1) The novel leaves the character's ethnicity undefined, but generally she seems like a tan caucasian (Prim, her sister, being blonde an indicator of this imo, because if Katniss was part, black, asian, brown or aboriginal a blonde sister seems pretty unlikely). 

2)  All of the actresses in final consideration were caucasian.  If the list above really was who the casting directors had narrowed it down to, we would have ended up with a pretty pale Katniss, but even with slightly more olive skin (Steinfeld is the only one on that list who fits the description - and is the only one who's mixed), Katniss would still be white.

I don't see white-washing in Lawrence's casting.  I see Hollywood default casting at work here, but not 'white-washing'. 

They haven't changed Katniss's ethnicity because it was never clearly identified in the book. They just decided that because Katniss wasn't specified as being [insert ethnicity here] that they would cast a caucasian.  Suzanne Collins is happy about the casting of Lawrence.  She said she never thought they'd find someone so perfect for the role, so obviously she doesn't see the casting as white-washing or a misinterpretation of her vision.  And all of the actresses being considered for the role were pretty pale and/or blonde so it's unlikely we would have ended up with even a tan/olive skinned Katniss even if Lawrence hadn't been cast.

Is it right that Hollywood will generally just cast white unless they have to cast a person of colour?  No, absolutely not.  But as I understand the term 'white-washing', the Hunger Games casting really doesn't apply.  If they got Mortez to play Rue (a black 12 year old), I'd say you have an argument for white-washing there.  But Jennifer Lawrence as Katniss?  Ish don't think so.

No one denies that white-washing and race-switching is a problem in Hollywood movies, I just think that the casting of Jennifer Lawrence in this particular movie is a weak example to get into such a large snit about.  This is not The Last Airbender, Prince of Persia:The Sands of Time, or 21.

Comments

[ishfeeny.livejournal.com]

Agree w/ everything you posted here, but especially the fact that if the author herself is satisfied w/ the casting, then shouldn't we be satisfied as well? While we all have some vision of what Katniss might look like as we read the books, the final, absolute vision is from the eyes of Collins. And if Collins's gives it the ok, it's fine w/ me.

[fembuck.livejournal.com]

Thank god, I'm not the only one who doesn't see what the big deal is. As a PoC myself, I usually pay attention to these things, but when I started hearing about 'white-washing' in regards to this movie I was like "Whaaaa?"

I guess the internet just has to be up in arms about something.

People are also complaining about Lawrence's age, as if a 20 year old being cast to play a teenager is absolutely unheard of. Like, who are these people that genuinely thought a 16 year old would be cast? It's a Hollywood movie!

[ishfeeny.livejournal.com]

I'm a PoC as well, and while I was up at arms over The Last Airbender (for multiple reasons, although the casting choices was one of them), I really don't understand where the complaints are coming from in regards to the Hunger Games.

...plus, not to geek out or anything but if Prim has blue eyes/blonde hair, then her dad must have had the dormant genes for it somewhere as well, so even if Katniss is mixed, it doesn't necessarily mean it has to show as much. I have plenty of mixed friends who if I didn't know personally I would have just assumed they were white.

As for the age thing, again, I could care less. Because hey, having an actress of a similar age would be great and all, but once again, I'd rather have an actress that could act her socks off in the role. And as you said, it's not necessarily something abnormal about Hollywood.

*shrugs*

[fembuck.livejournal.com]

The Last Airbender was definitely one to get up in arms about. That was blatant white-washing, and the movie itself was just horrible. Everything about that movie inspired rage.

so even if Katniss is mixed, it doesn't necessarily mean it has to show as much.

This.

Katniss was described in the books like Hollywood describes 'exotic' in casting calls. Basically dark hair, light eyes and a tan. She could be mixed, she could not be, we'll never know. Probably someone like Mila Kunis would be the most accurate in terms of looks, but ... whatever. Being olive-skinned doesn't define the character. After seeing Winter's Bone, there is no doubt in my mind that Lawrence will be able to play Katniss perfectly, so I don't care if she doesn't look like she gets much sun.

I'd rather have an actress that could act her socks off in the role.

Word. For this role especially I think it would have been difficult for them to cast a real teenager, because of the type of role it is. There's a gravitas that's needed for the character that most younger actresses don't have.

Fonseca is really the only other person on that list who I think would have been able to really pull it off, and she's 24. Actually Ronan would have been great too, but she's already got two assassin movies coming out, so I don't mind getting to see another actress playing a badass.

Anyway, I think some fans just like to complain about things. No matter who was cast these people would likely find something to bitch out. I just wish that the buzz wasn't so negative early on, and over something so stupid, but I want the whole trilogy to be made!

[ishfeeny.livejournal.com]

Not gonna lie, I wouldn't have minded Fonseca getting the role...although that's probably my bias towards her in Nikita more than anything else, but the girl can act and I could somewhat imagine her in Katniss's role, even with her age.

Perhaps I'm not as connected to the interwebs, but I haven't heart much negative buzz...granted, I haven't really heard ANY buzz so that kinda makes my previous statement moot, but whatever. Either way I look at it, chances are that once the movie comes out, I will be lining up with my friends who love the series as much as I do to watch it. We'll just have to wait and see how it turns out I suppose.

[fembuck.livejournal.com]

Not gonna lie, I'd have loved it if Fonseca had been cast too. Before seeing Nikita I might have turned my nose up at the suggestion, but Fonseca has showed amazing range and grit as Alex. I think she'd have done a fantastic job, and she looks younger than she is so I wouldn't have had a problem with her age.

Perhaps I'm not as connected to the interwebs, but I haven't heart much negative buzz...

I might be blowing the negative attention out of proportion. Really, I'm basing that statement on the article I just saw on the casting of Lawrence at AfterEllen, and on ONTD where there have been numerous posts about 'white-washing' and Lawrence being too old.

Of course, ONTD is full of turn-coat haters (seriously, they LOVED Lawrence up until the Oscars and now it's endless haterade), and the posters there are obsessed with posting topless pictures of Hunter Parrish and talking about how he's the perfect Peeta, so it's probably not the right site to base the general feeling around the movie on.

I just want the movie to be good. I want to love it like I'm loving the books, and I want it to make enough movie that they can film all three movies.

[lurkete.livejournal.com]

seconded

[fembuck.livejournal.com]

Welcome aboard the "Really? Really?" train. We have plenty of side-eye and deep sighs in the face!palm lounge, if you're interested!

[trancer21.livejournal.com]

There's a good essay here that breaks down a bit more of the coding in the book. While the author doesn't state outright that Katniss is a character of color there are more than a few hints.

My biggest gripe isn't with *who* was cast (honestly, I probably won't see the movie till it shows up on torrents) but in the casting process itself which descriptively asked for 'white actresses only'. Which is way more damning and problematic than who was actually cast.

Is the current out roar a mountain out of a molehill? Maybe. But considering Hollywood's loooonnnggg history of whitewashing characters, how long do people have to scream in the darkness before Hollywood actually listens?

[fembuck.livejournal.com]

There's a good essay here that breaks down a bit more of the coding in the book.

That essay is interesting, but it is also almost completely focused on things that someone just reading the novel would never know (the history of intermarriage in the geographic region that District 12 is based in, the history of mixed kids being named after plants etc.) In the book only vague clues that would be beyond the average readers ability to pick up on are given. I'm not a genius, but I'm not a complete idiot either, and while reading the novel I pretty much pictured Katniss looking like Lyndsy Fonseca after hitting the beach. I didn't know about the regional history (and I don't think most readers would, especially non-American readers) so when I started seeing 'white-washing' articles I was genuinely surprised.

If Collins really wanted to present a mixed race heroine, and it was important to her for people to know that Katniss was mixed, she could have made it clear with very little extra effort, and should have. The person in that article you linked even said they had to go back and re-read to pick up on the clues, and as I said, those clues are obscure enough that reasonably intelligent people could miss them/not understand the significance of them (i.e. hunting with a bow and arrow just seemed smart to me, and I took Katniss as a metaphor instead of as an indication of cultural identity).

I think it's more likely that Collins just wanted an 'exotic' heroine (dark hair, light eyes, tanned skin). Mila Kunis probably cursed the fact that she's in her late 20s now, because she's the type that usually gets offered roles when characters are described that way.

The fact that Collins herself doesn't seem to have a problem with the casting, and indeed thinks that Lawrence is perfect for the role, also indicates to me that she wasn't too invested in the idea of Katniss actually being seen/understood to be mixed race.

but in the casting process itself which descriptively asked for 'white actresses only'. Which is way more damning and problematic than who was actually cast.

This, I didn't know about. And this IS something to get up in arms about and hate on intensely. I didn't realize that they had basically banned anyone who wasn't white from reading for the part. That is ... I don't have words to describe how angry that makes me.

However, I'm still confused because a lot of the people complaining about Lawrence's casting LOVE Steinfeld and wanted her to be cast so ... the fans don't really seem upset that only white actresses were allowed to read (I've just learned that Stienfeld is actually mixed, she's half Filipino but I've never seen the people clamoring for her mention that so I'm assuming most of them don't know). Most fans seem upset that it was this particular white actress who was cast.

In the threads I've read about white-washing, I haven't actually seen someone suggest a non-white actress for the role (other than the people who just write that 'an unknown' should have been cast, and even that seems to indicate they just wish it wasn't Lawerence). THIS is really what is confusing to me.

But considering Hollywood's loooonnnggg history of whitewashing characters, how long do people have to scream in the darkness before Hollywood actually listens?

I totally think white-washing, white-default casting, and race-switching is a HUGE problem in Hollywood. I'm just saying that I don't quite get why this particular film and this particular role are getting so much heat considering that you have to be a historian or an expert on regional demographics in America to even prove/understand that there has been white-washing.

Hollywood needs to hear people roar, and things need to change, I just think this is a strange choice to rally around.

[kennedyismyhero.livejournal.com]

While I've heard the uproar of white-washing and don't get it either, I detest when studios do the stunt casting. Yes, less severe and uproar-worthy that race switching but still annoying. Those last five candidates wouldn't have had any trouble filling the role but they had to pick Winter's Bone girl - another nitpick of mine. I'd heard Lyndsy Fonseca, Emily Browning and Kaya Scodelario's names being tossed around for months and months, and even to a lesser extent Chloe Moretz, but I love how all of a sudden 2-3 months ago Jennifer Lawrence and Hailee Steinfeld seemed to shoot to the top of the list.

LAME! Picking a young Oscar nominee is gonna give any more legitimacy to your movie!

It's like they're doing all they can to distance themselves from any Twilight franchise comparisons, not that they're earned, but trying to stuff in a name that automatically has to come with the prefix "Oscar nominee" screams cheap and tacky.

Hrmm...maybe it's just me.

[fembuck.livejournal.com]

Jennifer Lawrence being cast does smack a little of stunt casting, or at least 'It Girl' casting, but I'm not annoyed by it since I like Lawrence. I'm guessing you didn't care for Winter's Bone, but she blew me away in it so I'm looking forward to seeing her in the role, even though it's likely she only got on casting director's radar because of the Oscar nom.

Fonseca is really the only other person on that list that I would have been excited to see in the role anyway.

It's like they're doing all they can to distance themselves from any Twilight franchise comparisons

If I was them, I'd try to do that too. I almost didn't read the first book because of all of the Twilight comparisons I'd heard, and when I read it I found that the books were NOTHING alike.

Now, I have no idea whether the movie will be crap or not, and if the writing, directing etc. are crap in the movie, Jennifer Lawrence and the "Oscar Nominee" billing they can give her won't mean a thing. But, I can't blame them for wanting to try and distance themselves from Twilight.

I'm just hoping the movie is good.

screams cheap and tacky.

It is kind of tacky and obvious, but that's Hollywood. I'll probably roll my eyes when I see the commercials with 'oscar nominee' slapped all over them, but if she's good in the role I don't really see that it matters.

I guess I also feel a bit bad for Lawrence at this point, getting shit on by everyone for things that are completely out of her control. Before the Oscars, everyone was blowing sunshine up her ass, and now it's like people would slap her for breathing.

[karatam.livejournal.com]

I admit I was pulling for Lyndsy to get the role, mostly because she's who I've been picturing when reading to novel. I don't really have a comment on Jennifer Lawrence because I haven't seen Winter's Bone yet (though it is definitely on my list of things to watch).

But thinking back, when I was reading the book, I definitely envisioned Katniss as white mainly because her mother and sister were blonde, which means to both sides of her family would need genes for blond hair (aka definitely at least partially Caucasian on both sides).

And in the end, I'm going to go with the author's vision of her main character, so if Collins approves, I'll cross my fingers and hope for the best.

(Though it's strange that Lyndsy and Kaya were probably front-runners up until the day the Oscar nominee list came out.)

[fembuck.livejournal.com]

I'd have been thrilled if Lyndsy got the role, but I'm happy with Lawrence as well. People seem to either really like or really hate Winter's Bone, but once you watch it I think you'll see why Lawrence has got so much buzz, and why she's an exciting choice for Katniss. Just like how seeing Lyndsy as Alex on Nikita made me think she'd do a great job as Katniss too.

when I was reading the book, I definitely envisioned Katniss as white mainly because her mother and sister were blonde, which means to both sides of her family would need genes for blond hair

I'm with ya on that. Until I started hearing the race!wank, it honestly never occurred to me that Katniss could be read as mixed-race. The olive-skinned description made me think of someone vaguely Mediterranean looking, like Mila Kunis (though I know she's Eastern European), basically a tan white person.

I've basically come to think that the race!wank isn't even really about Hunger Games. It's about people (rightly) being upset that it's really hard for minority actors to get good work or to see minorities represented on screen, and people are just talking their frustration out on this film even though the argument is pretty tenuous.

Though it's strange that Lyndsy and Kaya were probably front-runners up until the day the Oscar nominee list came out

The Oscar nominations definitely shot Lawrence and Steinfeld up to the top of the list. But I don't really have a problem with them shooting to the top of casting director's lists because of that. People are reacting like it was Miley Cyrus who got cast, like Lawrence is some basic bitch that gets work because people know her name now, but Lawrence can actually act, really well. So well she was nominated for an Oscar, which is why people now know her name.

It sucks that someone with less buzz around them like Fonseca probably dropped down on the list because of the Oscar nominees, but the film certainly won't suffer from Lawrence being cast.

[karatam.livejournal.com]

Collins definitely approved of the casting (http://insidemovies.ew.com/2011/03/21/hunger-games-suzanne-collins-jennifer-lawrence/)

[fembuck.livejournal.com]

Thanks for the link!

What a wonderful endorsement. Authors usually don't really release statements like that, so she must be very, very pleased to put it out there like that.

I was already excited to see Jennifer in the role, but now I'm super excited!

[gespawcho.livejournal.com]

Jesus Lord Christ. I agree completely that the casual reader of the novel would probably never have delved into all the stuff mentioned in the linked essay.

This is ridiculous. Jennifer Lawrence just played a tough, gritty teenager, which- as I understand it- is exactly what Katniss is supposed to be, correct? And shit, can you blame them for wanting a smidge of name recognition? Kaya probably is unknown to the vasssst majority of Americans. Fonseca and Browning aren't exactly household names. And while most people would recognize Hit Girl, I bet a lot of people wouldn't recognize Steinfeld either. Plus, though Steinfeld played an uncompromising character in TG, Lawrence has the kind of shifty look and body type that make me believe she could kick ass more convincingly than young Steinfeld. Moretz is too young, even though she ably demonstrated that she could beat people up.

THis shit is ridic. If the author never specified that Katniss was in fact of mixed origin, then most people wouldn't make that leap. And again, the contextual clues about the physical descriptions of Katniss' family also don't lend themselves to someone of mixed origin, superficially at least.

That said, since the author never explicitly said that Katniss was white, the casting call shouldn't have excluded people of other ethnicities.

This stuff annoys....

[fembuck.livejournal.com]

I agree completely that the casual reader of the novel would probably never have delved into all the stuff mentioned in the linked essay.

Totally. It's interesting, but there's no way in hell 95% of the audience would have had any idea about it. And most people would not have bothered to research after the fact either. There may be clues in the novel, but they are certainly not obvious, or ones most of the audience would pick up.

Jennifer Lawrence just played a tough, gritty teenager, which- as I understand it- is exactly what Katniss is supposed to be, correct?

Correct. In fact, if I was a casting director I could have cast her for Katniss from her Winter's Bone performance without even auditioning her because the roles are so similar. Katniss is a little bit softer than Ree, Lawrence will get to have some lighter and more playful moments as Katniss, but the characters are both very tough, gritty, determined, smart and resourceful.

Lawrence has the kind of shifty look and body type that make me believe she could kick ass more convincingly than young Steinfeld.

I totally agree with this. I thought Steinfeld was GREAT in "True Grit" but she is very delicate seeming. Katniss, isn't really very big, or very strong physically, but I can more easily picture Lawrence climbing trees and creeping through woods.

And again, the contextual clues about the physical descriptions of Katniss' family also don't lend themselves to someone of mixed origin, superficially at least.

Honestly, even if 'olive skinned' had made me wonder about Katniss's ethnicity, the description of her mother, but more particularly her sister would have made me go right back to think she was white.

That said, since the author never explicitly said that Katniss was white, the casting call shouldn't have excluded people of other ethnicities.

This infuriates me. It's not white-washing, but it's something very distasteful and is and has always been a big problem in Hollywood. Even if the casting call had gone with "exotic" as they often term things, it would have left the door open for a lot more actresses.

[bizarro-bluth.livejournal.com]

First off, thanks for THG news update! I've been a bit out of the loop, but I've been anxiously waiting for them to start casting for the film.

As for the controversy...I see Hollywood default casting at work here, but not 'white-washing'....I completely agree. And, personally, I'm just happy they cast a relatively new actress who has some major acting chops. The last thing I wanted was for them to cast some model who couldn't act at all. I'm sure once the fans see Jennifer in character as Katniss, some of the wank will die down.

[fembuck.livejournal.com]

No problem!

And, personally, I'm just happy they cast a relatively new actress who has some major acting chops.

I know, right! There's absolutely no way that Lawrence isn't going to be kickass in this role. Haters really need to calm down. I mean there are people out there that are trying to claim that Lawrence isn't an unknown. I'm like, you say the name Jennifer Lawrence to anyone who isn't a film buff and they'll have no idea who you're talking. She is a new talent, and a very exciting one.

The last thing I wanted was for them to cast some model who couldn't act at all. I'm sure once the fans see Jennifer in character as Katniss, some of the wank will die down.

I know, people are acting like they cast Miley Cyrus in the role or something. She's an Oscar nominee! How is that a bad thing for a film? And I'm sure that once the movie comes out and Lawrence is amazing all of the haters will jump on her bandwagon. Ugh. Internet fandom is so fickle.

I can't wait to see how batshit crazy people are going to get when Peeta is cast if Hunter Parrish doesn't get the role.

[rtms.livejournal.com]

Here (http://jezebel.com/#!5781682/the-imminent-whitewashing-of-the-hunger-games-heroine) is another essay on the whole issue. I can honestly say that her ethnicity blew right by me and I never noticed the idea she was or maybe mixed raced.

[fembuck.livejournal.com]

I'm pretty sure that Katniss's ethnicity blew my 95% of readers, probably more actually.

The wealthier merchant class, including Katniss's mom and sister, generally are described with fair hair and skin.

I've seen this argument a lot and it blows my mind. Katniss and Prim are full sisters, so the argument that Prim represents upper-class, white privilege while Katniss represented coloured folk having a hard-knocked life boggles my mind.

Katniss and Prim's father had to carry the gene for blond hair if Prim ended up with blond hair. Katniss obviously would not look like Willow Smith (someone actually suggested her, I'm not joking).

The casting call shouldn't have specified only Caucasian actresses, because with a mixed father Katniss's looks could line up with a variety of actresses from different backgrounds. Just like they'll dye Lawrence's dark dark brown, they could have given a part-black, part-Filipino, or part-east asian actress blue-ish grey contacts) but the people behind the film chose not to do that. It's not really white-washing, but it's pretty distasteful and upsetting.

[angela627.livejournal.com]

I didn't even read THG and I haven't even seen Winter's Bone yet so it's not like I'm a big ole Jennifer Lawrence fan but I think fans need to just get over it that their favorite actress of choice didn't get the role. I think it's just a bunch of fans backlashing cause they're getting pissy, over the dumbest reasons.

Especially the Hailee fans complaining about the age thing, Jennifer is 20, she isn't 40 years old. And omg, she's blond! Have people never heard of hair dye? It's unbelievable the way fans get.

I adore Lyndsy but I think fans of hers should be happy she was among the list with OSCAR NOMINATED actresses like Jennifer and Hailee. While she didn't get the role, I think reading for the role itself will lead to more opportunities for her in the future.

[fembuck.livejournal.com]

I didn't even read THG and I haven't even seen Winter's Bone

You should do both! Especially THG. I've only read the first book, but I loved it. Winter's Bone is a good movie, but it was depressing as hell. There were some amazing performances in it, though.

I think fans need to just get over it that their favorite actress of choice didn't get the role.

Oh for sure. A lot of the people complaining are just butt-hurt, and they sound ridiculous.

Especially the Hailee fans complaining about the age thing, Jennifer is 20, she isn't 40 years old. And omg, she's blond! Have people never heard of hair dye? It's unbelievable the way fans get.


I know. The age!wank is ridiculous. 20 is not too old to be playing a teenager, and you cannot judge how old Jennifer looks by red carpet appearances. She looks much younger on screen and in interviews than in red carpets pics because she's not as made up. She'll look perfectly believable. Besides, other than Halilee, the actress who got the most buzz were OLDER than Lawrence.

Seriously, with Katniss being 16 there was almost no way that someone under the age of 19 was going to be cast.

I adore Lyndsy but I think fans of hers should be happy she was among the list with OSCAR NOMINATED actresses

Heh. Yeah, I know. It's impressive just to be in such company. Honestly though, I haven't heard Lyndsy fans slamming the casting or going on about how she's robbed. Probably because Lyndsy fans are a bit older than the Steinfeld fans, and realize that while they would have liked her to be cast, she's not the only person on the planet capable of playing the role.