Because Kelis always says it best ... "I hate you so much right now, AHHHHHHH!"

[fembuck]

So, trancer21 just posted an awesome review (SPOILERS!!  Don't click the link if you are afraid of SPOILERS!!!) of WWBC (with scrolling font, ya'll).

I have run out of words to describe my fucking epic hate-on for Cock Block right now, so I will respond to this entirely in graphics.

THE KILLER IS SOMEONE WHO'S NEVER BEEN INTRODUCED!!! Yep, that's right. It was some dude Ivy burned years ago and has been sitting in jail sight unseen.



Now, why does Rachel get rage against Kisten's killer when Ivy does not? Why is Rachel's love, and need for vengence, for a man she knew for less than a year *greater* than Ivy's love for someone she's known ALMOST ALL HER LIFE!?!

To: Ivy
From: Cock Block


Kisten's killer is killed by Kisten himself! Yep. His love for Rachel is so true, so real that even as a soulless undead vamp, he remembers their love and protects her ONE LAST TIME!!



Hey, did you know Rachel has a ghost in her church? Did you know that ghost has been there for almost a year? Oh and that ghost is a person from her past that Rachel has a DEEP AND MEANINGFUL CONNECTION with? A person that, after 6 books, appr. 2850 paperback pages and 1,000,000 words WE'VE NEVER HEARD ABOUT BEFORE!?!



Finding out Rachel's inspiration/motivation for joining the I.S. is a good thing, finding out 7 books later? Finding out that it's because of a ghost who - was the previous owner of her late father's watch, her first 'good kiss', a witch, involved somehow with Al and, oh yeah, a lifetime member of the 'Coven of Moral and Ethical Standards'...STEPHENIE MEYER SPARKLY-COVERED LLLAAAAMMMMEEEEE!!!



Has it ever been mentioned before that Ivy has a sister? Because I was all 'Erica who in the what now?'

Erica was first mentioned in Book 3. Rachel met her just before she met Skimmer at Ivy's parents house. She's popped up a bit sense then, but always in really small doses, because Ivy's life doesn't matter.

And do Ivy's parents actually have names?



*calms, remembers ... Ivy's life DOESN'T MATTER.*

What I feel at the thought of 6 more books ...



Edited for my response tojulygreen's comment below that the WWBC story that we've read (or in some cases just bought) is the product that was produced AFTER the editors made their suggestions and demands.  Or as julygreen put it "Unless ... they [the editors] did [make suggestions to improve the story], and this is actually the improved version ... ?"


I know that not funny, it's horrifying. But I have to laugh..

... because sometimes words are not enough to fully express my loathing.

Comments

[dhamphir]

Umm... wow. I've never read any of the Hollows books. And it doesn't look like I ever will. Of course, I'm always behind the times anyway. I never saw Buffy or Xena until they were off TV and on DVD.

[fembuck.livejournal.com]

You're probably better off going back and reading the books after the series is done. And by that what I mean is, if Rachel and Ivy get together in the end you should totally go back and read select books in the series (ex. Book 1, 2, 4, 5, and I don't know if anymore decent ones will pop up...)

Honestly, it all starts off really well, but begins to stagnate and go nowhere that I want to be.

[dhamphir]

Knowing me, I'll probably wait for the movie! LOL.

[wishing-wounds.livejournal.com]

The last graphic finally killed me.

One note: I do believe Pierce was actually mentioned in a short story Kim Harrison wrote set in the Hollows series. There's a lot of short story collections out there by all the popular supernatural authors and I remember reading about him in one of the holiday ones.

There's also one that revolves around Ivy's life pre-Rachel, but I don't remember which book I have it in.

[fembuck.livejournal.com]

One note: I do believe Pierce was actually mentioned in a short story Kim Harrison wrote set in the Hollows series.

Yeah, I heard that after I read his introduction. But I still call fuckery. Those are side books, not part of the Rachel Morgan series. It's a bit ridiculous to think that everyone went out and bought the anthology stories (I was going to, but there was no way I was laying out that amount of money for like 20 pages). So, to just up and act like we were all just waiting for him to appear again, when a large chunk of the audience had no idea who he was was stupid.

Mia didn't jar, because she was organically added into the plot, and it wasn't played like, "OMG! MIA HARBOUR! SHE USED TO PULL MY HAIR AND SNAP MY UNDIES AND NOW SHE'S MY BIGGEST ENEMY EVER and has been secrety sucking my life essense away for a year even though she was never mentioned in any of the books you have read or even hinted at".

There's also one that revolves around Ivy's life pre-Rachel, but I don't remember which book I have it in.

I wish Cock Block would combine these side stories in like a little novella type book, like "Tales of Beddle the Bard" or something so that I could just buy that. Because I want to read them, well the Ivy one, not the epic saga of Pierce and Rachel's Romeo and Juliet style tragic 24 hour love affair. But I'm not paying for that anthology, and I'm not sitting on the floor for an hour to read it in the store (well, maybe in the summer when I have more time).

[julygreen.livejournal.com]

One note: I do believe Pierce was actually mentioned in a short story Kim Harrison wrote set in the Hollows series. There's a lot of short story collections out there by all the popular supernatural authors and I remember reading about him in one of the holiday ones.

I heard about that, too. Clever cross-referencing, or money-making opportunism? I'm calling the latter.

[trancer21.livejournal.com]

I don't EVER want to live in a world where this isn't FUNNIER THAN SHIT!! OMG, I love it.. loveitloveitloveit LOVE IT!! *grumble*wish I'd thought of it*grumble*

So like who are we paying in a year to be the guinea pig that reads the next installment *first*?

[fembuck.livejournal.com]

I don't EVER want to live in a world where this isn't FUNNIER THAN SHIT!!

I'm glad I could provide some lols. Sometimes a .gif really is worth a thousand words.

So like who are we paying in a year to be the guinea pig that reads the next installment *first*?

I'm sure some brave soul will step up to the plate. Shant be me, though. I'm not getting book 8 until it's a paperback (unless of course Rachel suddenly realizes her feelings, and she and Ivy make sweet, sweet love. That and only that could get me to buy a hardcover copy). And honestly, I'm tempted to wait to see if any bootleg e-book versions show up, read that and then buy a paper book if the book doesn't completely make me want to bash my head against a wall.

[http://users.livejournal.com/_slutknot_/]

.........
DONE.

Fuck this-
I'm goin' back to the HP fandom.

This will make you feel better.

[http://users.livejournal.com/_slutknot_/]

(http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v638/_slutknot_/?action=view&current=b4b42q.gif)

[ediwan-kenobi.livejournal.com]

What I feel at the thought of 6 more books ...

WTF??? O.O Six more books?!?!? One more book, I can stand.. two maybe... but SIX??? ANd Knowing KH she's going to be introducing more and more douchebags in the scene.. Fuck!!! this is a Nightmare..


Stupid Kim HArrison.. Reading ALL the fucking 7 books just for nothing
YEs Rachel loves Ivy
Yes Rachel had admit that she have fantasies about Ivy
Yes Rachel wants save Ivy from lost her soul
BUt Rachel doesn't Want to HAVE SEX whit IVy!! Just because she's a woman??? What's wrong with her (& KIm HArrison)???
HEr mother drop her when she was a baby or What??
ANd they LOVE each other for God's sake!!!


Well I hope that Ivy finds a good, sexy & loving woman, Rachel doesn't deserve her love anymore..





I HAte Kim HArrison so much Right Now...

[fembuck.livejournal.com]

WTF??? O.O Six more books?!?!? One more book, I can stand.. two maybe... but SIX??

Yeah. I know. I don't know if 6 more is 100% confirmed, but if Cock Block has mentioned it, then it's probably as close to a done deal as possible. There's going to be another 2 for sure though.

I would have been able to handle 9, but four more after that is too much for me. I think it'll be the length of the series, more than the cock-blocking that will get me to stop reading. I have a short attention span, I cannot follow this for another six years. I will lose interest. It is a fact ... a future fact.

BUt Rachel doesn't Want to HAVE SEX whit IVy!! Just because she's a woman??? What's wrong with her (& KIm HArrison)???

*Sigh* Yeah. Rachel's denial is unbelievable and ridiculous at this point. She should have said, "What the hell, let's try this" by now. She's obviously curious, she herself admits that she's thought about it, and she continues to think about it. Rachel hasn't even put forth the idea that she's scared about losing Ivy as a friend if things don't work out (which would be the strongest reason to hold back in my opinion). All of her resistance is focused on the fact that Ivy is female, but Rachel's responses to Ivy has shown that she is CLEARLY capable of physically responding to Ivy and being aroused by her. That plus her admitted love for Ivy, should have made Rachel give them a try books ago.

Rachel doesn't deserve her love anymore..

I'm feeling this way more and more. I kind of want a good woman to save Ivy from Rachel at this point. Rachel could have helped Ivy overcome her problems, but at this point Rachel is just the cause of Ivy getting more problems and loathing herself more.

[julygreen.livejournal.com]

That last gif - impossibly funny! Man oh man.

I know Cockblock stays away from fanfiction (as discussed in the other post), but I wonder how aware she is of the opinions of her fanbase. Like, how could you resist not taking a peek at the Amazon reviews, at least? It seems like a sizeable chunk of people over there (who write actual reviews) are frustrated with the bullshittery and have called out the flaws ... seems like most of the 5-star reviews are of the misspelled-one-line variety.

Of course, her editors apparently didn't step in and make even the most basic of criticisms, so I guess it doesn't matter ...

(Unless ... they did, and this is actually the improved version ... ?)

[fembuck.livejournal.com]

but I wonder how aware she is of the opinions of her fanbase. Like, how could you resist not taking a peek at the Amazon reviews, at least? It seems like a sizeable chunk of people over there (who write actual reviews) are frustrated with the bullshittery and have called out the flaws ... seems like most of the 5-star reviews are of the misspelled-one-line variety.

I don't know if she does, but I hope that she does. It would be useful to hear what people who don't have a monetary stake in the franchise have to say. The publishers want to make money, but if they push her in a direction that annoys fans they are going to ultimately lose money, and Cock Block will lose fans. For the first five books or so, when she was left to her own devices and working towards a well-concieved conclusion, I thought she could do no very little wrong. The last two books have made Cock Block a lot less shiny to me. If this series had ended with book 6 or even with book 9 (and with Ravy) I probably would have followed Cock Block to another series. But if she's planning on this fucking 14 book series, the eff that yo! I'm outtie.

Unless ... they did, and this is actually the improved version ... ?



I know that not funny, it's horrifying. But I have to laugh.

[runetraverse.livejournal.com]

*sighs, snugs* Lessee - maybe I could make some of of the bad feeling better? (forgive me, it's long, I know.)

A lot of the things that weren't introduced before were part of the three short stories - there were a couple comments in news articles about the book, plus she commented on it during the tours. (Which yes, sucked dishwater, 'cause I didn't realize how MUCH came from those until after I finished either, and I haven't read the damned things.) Her camp's attitude was pretty much that WWBC was supposed to tie all three of the other stories in to main Hollows canon.

Now, why does Rachel get rage against Kisten's killer when Ivy does not? Why is Rachel's love, and need for vengence, for a man she knew for less than a year *greater* than Ivy's love for someone she's known ALMOST ALL HER LIFE!?!

Actually, I think Ivy really did get to have her reaction to Kisten's killer, especially after finding them in the tunnels - but frankly, her reaction wasn't instant rage because it isn't in her personality. Think about the two of them. Ivy is characterized by her constant need for control, especially over herself and her emotions - her dialogue when they were searching in the tunnels definitely showed that. And her . . . well, not helplessness, exactly, but her shocked 'I don't know what to do' attitude? It falls right in line with her earlier angst about how Piscary warped her, and her problems dealing with her feelings. There's no one left to lash out at, since everyone connected with it is dead; that means the only thing she has left is her grief, which shuts her down just like any other strong emotion she feels. She literally can't explode, because it all turned inward. Rachel, on the other hand . . . *eyeroll* the girl wears her feelings on her sleeve, and she still insists that there should be balance and justice in the world, even after all the shit she's been through. Of course she's going to go ramapaging. She's the one that gets pissed off on Ivy's behalf, remember?

Kisten's killer is killed by Kisten himself! Yep. His love for Rachel is so true, so real that even as a soulless undead vamp, he remembers their love and protects her ONE LAST TIME!!

Not quite. He remembered he loved Rachel before, which is supposed to be common to all the undead. Ivy mentions her mother still loving her father without knowing why, and it's brought up again in the conversation with Peter-the-sick-living-vamp in Makinaw. Even then, it took him actually seeing her to intervene - he listened to her screaming in pain and the killer dragging her back down the hall without caring at all. And he didn't try to kill the killer until the guy mentioned hurting Ivy; Kisten literally goes from "I don't think I want him to hurt you" wavering to "I will kill you before you hurt them both" badassery. And in the end, he tells Rachel that he did it to protect them both - his last words are for Rachel to tell Ivy that it's not her fault. So it's not necessarily his love for just Rachel, but his love for the both of them together.

As for Erica, you mentioned that already - and yeah, I think her parents' names are mentioned in the book where Rachel goes to Ivy's house. Don't remember which one, only that Rachel met Ivy's dad, and I think it's the same one where Erica threw her caps in the snow. Erica was at their Solstice BBQ, too, talking Takata's ear off. xD

--------

On another note, was I the only one that actually thought she might have thrown a bone to the femslash readers with the couple at the airport? A stable, loving lesbian couple with three children, no less. And not only are they well-crafted, but who do they remind Rachel of? Herself and Ivy - and a good portion of Rachel's musing there is that the two of them can't have a normal relationship like the one these two women have. Coincidence? I think not.

(Don't mind me, just finished reading it fully and I'm hyper. Probably not good for 1am, but eh. xD)

[fembuck.livejournal.com]

A lot of the things that weren't introduced before were part of the three short stories ... Her camp's attitude was pretty much that WWBC was supposed to tie all three of the other stories in to main Hollows canon.

The short stories are a separate entity from the series. A lot of people who have read all the books haven't read the shorts from the anthologies. If the publisher insisted on this, it's just one more piece of evidence that they are a bunch of money grubbing whores. Making people go out and buy the three anthologies to get what's happening in the series is ridiculous. Mia's stuff was fine, because you didn't need to have read the shorts to understand her significance. The Pierce stuff was ridiculous though, because Rachel's suppose to have this amazing connection to him, and half of the audience has never heard of him before.

I understand why the publishers would want this from a marketing/profit standpoint, but from a narrative viewpoint it's weak.

On another note, was I the only one that actually thought she might have thrown a bone to the femslash readers with the couple at the airport?

Yeah, I C what she did thar. But it's still just a bone. It was like three sentences. I'm not emotionally invested in those two women at the airport, I haven't been reading about them for seven books. Yes, it was nice to have a mention of a lesbian couple who are loving, but I'd rather see Rachel and Ivy become a loving lesbian couple. Cock Block will get my kudos then. Not for a couple sentence long PSA about how gays are people, only to have Rachel continue to deny the possibility of a romantic relationship with Ivy. Rachel and Ivy can't be happy like that, because Cock Block keeps cock-blocking them.

P.S. Don't mind my tone, my irritation is directed at cock-block, not at you. I haven't finished the book yet, but I your analysis of the Ivy/Rachel conversation in the tunnels will be in my head when I read it, and probably make it all seem a lot more touching to me. I appreciate the Ravy coloured glasses, I want to put my own on again, but I have to take baby steps ;)

[trancer21.livejournal.com]

Heh, actually the quotes about the book are mine, Janine just emphasized them if .gif form (because she's awesome like that). So, I'll respond here.

She's the one that gets pissed off on Ivy's behalf, remember?

I understand what you're saying and, on its own, makes sense. But imo, overall, is just another instance of making it 'All About Rachel'. Another instance of one person's grief and anger and needing to lash out at those that wronged them being projected onto Rachel because.. well she's the 'special one'. Plus, hypocritical that Edden gives an 'don't do it' type speech to Ivy but Rachel's given the 'out' to do just that. Rachel's 'rage' is given justification, when Ivy's is negated.

So it's not necessarily his love for just Rachel, but his love for the both of them together.

Meh, six of one, half dozen the other. Imo, since Kisten's death, his relationship was retconned into something more than what it actually was. Having spent two books trying to find his killer only to realize that a) his killer was already dead and b) Kisten killed him himself seemed like a lame cop-out to what could, and should, have been an interesting storyline. Imo, 'Kisten's love saved them both' is, well, lame. Kisten killing his own killer as opposed to Rachel and Ivy finding him seems like contrivance. And don't get me started on Rachel finding the killer, not through her own detecting skills, but by basically getting knocked out!! Just think of all the crap that could have been skipped if someone had just punched her *really* hard at the beginning of book 6.

I mean, I do like what you're saying. Like, for the most part, I like the arc Harrison has set up for Ivy because it's a 'nature vs. nurture' thing. Are vampires really evil creatures, or are they evil due to a culture that propagates violence? I like that, together, Rachel and Ivy are going to find the solution to vampires keeping their souls. It's just.. at the rate Harrison keeps piling on Rachel's 'I'm a special little snowflake'-ness, I dread an arc about Ivy becoming 'ALL ABOUT RACHEL'.. again.

ETA: ..was I the only one that actually thought she might have thrown a bone to the femslash readers with the couple at the airport?

Oh yeah, it was definitely a bone. I was actually more floored by the revelation that Rachel fantasizes about having sex with Ivy!! Oh yeah, she's *totally* straight.

Gah! Why Am I Not Asleep!!

[trancer21.livejournal.com]

Damn you and your well-reasoned arguments and making me think!

She's the one that gets pissed off on Ivy's behalf, remember?

Yes, and I get that and I get what Harrison was trying to do in that scene. It just didn't work for me. Part of the problem is Edden. I don't think he should have been there.. at all. Second, the character stagnation in Rachel, Edden's speech to Ivy *should* have been Rachel. I would have rather had Rachel talking Ivy down from the ledge, putting someone else besides her self first, taking Ivy's grief and rage and pain into herself because she doesn't want to lose Ivy and *then* turning it towards Ash. I mean, I know Rachel gives justification for her actions that are *supposed* to come across as selfless, it still looked like Rachel thinking about her self *first* for me.. and Rachel being the one to get 'final justice' against Kisten's killer.

I just feel so much of WWBC could have been.. better. I feel Harrison writes Rachel into these interesting, dramatic corners and then chooses the *easiest* way for Rachel to get out of them. The entire 'Who Killed Kisten' plot is, imo, exactly that.

[lostingeekdom.livejournal.com]

The airport scene was the one that made me sit up and take notice. To me it sounded like Rachel was finally trying to deal with her gay panic, and realizing what she could potentially have with Ivy, if she let herself.

[ic1pher.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I get that for one not having read the short stories the plot might get very weird. Myself having read them, it was pretty logical. But reading the short stories shouldn't be really a requirement to enjoy the books.

It's not like Pierce is anything new, just a very poorly built male character whose only purpose is to romance Rachel. Which sucks. I don't hate, I just get very disappointed.

The reaction to Kisten's killer also made sense to me because Ivy is a lot more controlled, thoughtful and subtle; Rachel being the bull in a china-shop, in relationship, in her work, everything really.

Does this mean that you are completely done with the series? It really sucks that this whole series has such a great premise. Witch and a hot vampire, two women slowly falling in love while fighting supernatural enemies in the modern society. I'm sure somebody could write it better. There just isn't enough good fantasy literature with this sort of setting. I wish there was, because I would devour it instantly.

[fembuck.livejournal.com]

But reading the short stories shouldn't be really a requirement to enjoy the books.

This is all I'm saying. And, I mean the Mia thing worked fine. I haven't read the shorts, but I was able to follow everything that had to do with her. It was the big emotional reveal about Pierce and then the continuing big deal being made about Pierce that bugged, because I didn't know him from Mike.

The reaction to Kisten's killer also made sense to me because Ivy is a lot more controlled, thoughtful and subtle; Rachel being the bull in a china-shop, in relationship, in her work, everything really.

Haven't read this part yet, so I'll reserve judgment. A controlled response from Ivy, does make sense though. I just need to see how it actually plays out.

Does this mean that you are completely done with the series? It really sucks that this whole series has such a great premise.

More than the cock-blocking the new projected length of the series is what's making me really consider jumping ship. I do not have a long attention span. Honestly, if I hadn't been able to read the first six back to back, and I'd had to wait between books I probably would have forgotten/stopped caring about it. If I knew that Book 9 was going to be the last, and one way or another I'd get resolution I'd keep reading just to finish. But another six books ... I don't know if I'm capable of doing it. I'm not wired that way ;)

*Sigh* Sometimes I really hate capitalism. I imagine what the series could have been like if it had ended with the sixth book (not the actual sixth book, but the book that would have existed if the series hadn't been extended) and it's beautiful. I think that if things had stuck to the original book length that this would have been a series that I would have guiltlessly recommended to people. Now, if I recommend it, I need to include a disclaimer, "Well, the first five were good ..."

[prim8.livejournal.com]

I'm just gonna stop reading once I reach book 4, I think. Authors should really listen to their fans.
More Ivy!
More GOOD things for Ivy!
And Ravy, for fuvk's sake. It's the only pairing that makes sense. *bangs head*

[fembuck.livejournal.com]

I'm just gonna stop reading once I reach book 4, I think.

Read book 5 as well. That one is good. Six and Seven I can't recommend without a warning though. I'm feeling more kindly towards Book 7 as it comes to an end, but the beginning is frustrating as hell. Give Book 5 a read though.

More Ivy!
More GOOD things for Ivy!

This. Please, Cock Block give the woman a break. I just got to a part in Book 7 that has some happy, playful, joking Ivy and it is glorious. She is so dreamy when she is happy. Funny too. I want more of that.

[madndizzee.livejournal.com]

darn it, i can't see the graphics! ok, definitely sticking to borrowing from the library when it comes out or just skipping it altogether. heck, i'm kinda losing interest in the books now. i'll just stick to fanfics.

[fembuck.livejournal.com]

The pictures should be up again tomorrow (or on Tuesday). Stupid bandwidth limits!

heck, i'm kinda losing interest in the books now.

Yeah, I know what you mean. The series is going on for too long. I can usually barely hand trilogies. Harry Potter is the longest series I've read (and now this). But I'm getting kind of burned out on it. I just want things wrapped up and for it to end.